Canseco and Wallace "60 Minutes"
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| By dorrit on Sunday, February 13, 2005 - 05:11 pm:|
Jose and Mike ought to be QUITE interesting tonight. I'd like to read everyone's thoughts when it's over..
WELL,WELL,WELL!!! Saw the interview. I can't believe I wanted to be this guy when I was growing up. Canseco is such an ASS!!! After he blows the MILLION$ he is going to make on his book...he will find himself all alone and depressed with the producers of the 'Surreal Life' not even wanting to call him up. There is truth behind alot of what he is saying...I think that its obvious... but the way he is going about it is so classless and he is stabbing many people in the back. Jose's intentions are 100% selfish and sickening!!! THE GUY IS FRIGGIN TELLING PEOPLE TO DO STEROIDS!!! AFTER ALL OF THIS!!! AFTER ATHLETES ARE DYING AND GETTING TUMORS AND HAVING THEIR LIVES RUINED FOREVER>>>THIS F**KIN'GUY IS TELLING KIDS, AND FUTURE CAL RIPKEN'S and MICHAEL JORDANS...TO DO ROIDS!!!! F*CK HIM and his book. I hope this all ends soon so we can get back to a ROID free baseball.
| By asch on Sunday, February 13, 2005 - 06:53 pm:|
I don't know what to think....
We don't know what happened behind the doors - and that's meant in a lot of ways:
1. Dhe really do steroids with all these guys he says? Mac? Irod? Viagra? Juan Gone? Giambi?
2. Were some of those guys his good friends who then turned their back on him when he "needed" them?
Does that really matter? No, I guess not - maybe there is no excuse for what he's doing...I definitely think it's weird, but I still think there is something going on here we don't know about. Maybe he's doing this to get back at people....but what did they do?
I definitely think that the BigMac defense is really weird. Seems like whenver there is a sniff that someone is gonna bring up steroids and McGwire in the same sentence, TLR or someone else comes out and gushes on Mark's behalf - they all defend him as if there is NO way he did steroids....or that there is NO way he and Canseco were in cahoots... I don't know...it seems weird to me that all these guys come out in defense of McGwire like that...makes me think that something IS indeed up...and he is guilty of something. And maybe that is why Jose is pissed? Not that I condone what he's doing, I just don't know.....
Sorry, those are my ramblings...I am confused.
For some reason though, I don't think Jose is lying. And that makes me wonder: Are the people upset about Jose doing this more upset about him being a "rat" or more upset that he in fact did steroids? And, on that note, what should the bigger story be?
The fact that steroids are in the PUREST game ever, disgusts me...but as a man I am equally disgusted by the way Jose is RATTING (if they did do the dirt) people out. Call that what you want guys...integrity, courage, honesty... I call it BULLSH8T!!! Its being done the wrong way. There is a code among all MEN (cant speak for the ladies)...to never snitch on your peers. I'm a Sergeant with the 101st Airborne Division...we live by the same code. Canseco is what we like to call... A BITCH.
| By eyleenn on Sunday, February 13, 2005 - 08:14 pm:|
I am watching the interview as I type this and it is making me nauseous.
| By sactodavey on Sunday, February 13, 2005 - 08:28 pm:|
this whole world is full of corruption , to me i don't balme Canseco in as much becuase he did it to become a better athlete which made him millions but i do blame MLB the commishioner and the henchmen who probably knew about this problem and never did anything about it becAuse incresed HR's meant increased attendance and millions of dollars.
blame the hiearchy of baseball who are at fault for not stopping this becuse if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck it is a ?????? we all can see Bonds got real big awfull fast and so did many players no doubt the big wigs in baseball knew with thier doctors something was not right but it means $$$ every juiced induced HR so LET IT RIDE!!!!!
| By oaktownmojo on Sunday, February 13, 2005 - 09:22 pm:|
I'm with Oaktowngreen. When I was in high school, Canseco was a hero of mine and now he makes me sick.
Wallace got him in the interview. In the book, Canseco claims he injected McGwire "often" but in the interview he said "twice." We which is it.
Maybe I want to believe McGwire was clean but if you look at the character of Cancesco (multiple arrests), it is hard to believe. To me he seems like a desperate man.
I am no Pollyana, I realize that players maybe but these are very serious allegations.
| By oakchick on Sunday, February 13, 2005 - 09:44 pm:|
When you were in high school athletics, did ANYONE offer you steroids? I find JC believable (in spite of the fact that he is a total ass) because this stuff is so easily available....and I did not even grow up in the US!
As a matter of fact, I was cut off the my high school track team because I was the only one not doping in, of all places...Singapore!
Even if JC is not the most reliable source, it is not that hard to get juiced. Just today I went down to my local GNC as a lark (in honor of Canseco and Giambi) and said I "needed something to improve performance" and the dude behind the counter got kinda shifty and said he could hook me up with "really good stuff". I came home and looked it up and realized it was dog steroids.
How scary. Bow wow wow!
| By asch on Sunday, February 13, 2005 - 09:44 pm:|
Let's put it this way, do you all think Big Mac use steroids? Do you think Jose is telling the truth at all?
I caught the same thing you did mojo - with the "often" and then "twice" but for some reason, I don't know why, I think Jose is telling the truth. Maybe I am wrong and it certainly isn't because I like the guy....
| By deajay on Sunday, February 13, 2005 - 09:49 pm:|
As big a jerk as I think this guy is, I am finding it difficult not to believe some of what he is saying. What sickens me is his push for athletes taking steroids, because of the kids.
Was the guest sportswriter on there named Ryan? He seemed to have the most intelligent input of all. I thought he made a pretty bold point in his comments about Selig/mlb never once coming out with ads against steroids. Maybe the most sickening thing to me was watching the tapes of Fehr and Bud Light and realizing once again how pathetically they have been dropping the ball in this whole issue for years. Ryan's right, this will be a big part of Bud Light's legacy.
I believe a huuuuuge part of the blame for this having gone on so long ... and, yes, resulting in harm and even death to some youngsters, not to mention the likes of Caminiti, and perhaps even a couple of other ballplayers who have died ... belongs in the court of mlb and the players' union, and likely, the owners, as well. I think the players' union approach to drug testing for years, has been abominable. Hey, it's all about money and I guess it will continue to be until more of these athletes become physically destroyed. Makes one wonder how many right now, are ticking timebombs.
And, I firmly believe more and more, that any HR records Bonds sets should have an asterisk. Though he and Sheffield watered it down and played "Mr. Innocents", they did admit to doing steroids, although not nearly to the extent they have. And you can bet that before they gave their testimony they discussed with one another getting their stories straight ... without a doubt. One thing you can say about Giambi, in the end he told the truth; as a result he has become the poster child.
And I have huuuge doubts about McGwire and Sosa, as well. Regardless what LaRussa says. And when they continue this interview Wednesday, I hope Wallace continues to bring Selig, Fehr, mlb to the forefront. They are simply a huuuge part of the problem's escalation and the embarrassment it has brought to baseball.
Jose Canseco is a pathetic jerk and he's not too bright, besides and yes, he is a snitch. But I agree with Stewart and Rickey, it's hard to know whether he is a liar.
| By kevink on Sunday, February 13, 2005 - 10:01 pm:|
Saw the interview.
I think Jose is telling the truth and is also embelishing the truth to sell books.
All the names he mentioned I'm sure were invovled with steroids. Who knows how much of it was Jose's doing though?
Canseco is a lost soul and a bitter man, but he has opened up a can of worms.
What will be the reaction of these players? Other players? Fans?
What will the reaction be when Bonds hits #755 & 756?
I am very disappointed in all this and to think I had a poster of Mr. Steroids 40/40 in 1989 is sad to me.
The worst thing about Jose is telling kids that steroids are good as long as there is "supervision." Kids will just take the stuff now like what oakchick pointed out, dog steroids and things that absolutely will have destructive effects on them, thinking that they will become super athletes. Very sad and disappointing.
We all know LaRussa is fiercely loyal so I would never have expected him to listen to anything negative about his boy McGwire, but to not think McGwire was caught up in this stuff is to bury your head in the sand.
There's so much more to say here but I will leave it at that and I am very let down by all this and feel that in some respects we have all been duped and none of these HR records mean anything past around 1988.
| By rono on Sunday, February 13, 2005 - 10:49 pm:|
Bonds, McGwire, Canseco
Did roids, are moody people, all have expressed bitterness in one way or another.It's part of their game. They all deserve our disdain.
| By pachyderm on Sunday, February 13, 2005 - 11:40 pm:|
Canseco's interview on "60 Minutes" was interesting and nothing surprising. I wish Wallace could ask more tougher questions during the interview. Canseco's creditiblity is Mac's best friend more then TLR.
| By simplefan on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 08:36 am:|
Here is ESPN's spin on it Post interview:
| By kevink on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 08:47 am:|
If someone accused me of steroids and I was 100% innocent, I'd be doing EVERYTHING in my power to prove it and to get back at them.
| By yc2578 on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 08:52 am:|
But in the process of trying to get back at them you may have to out other teammates.
| By kevink on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 09:28 am:|
| By asch on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 10:22 am:|
I agree kevin. THe lack of personal interviews to denounce involvement makes me believe the accusations are true.
I think IF they did come out and categorically deny it (ie. have a press conference like Jason) that people who may have been involved like clubhouse attendants etc may come out to say they are lying and that they WERE involved.
It makes it easier for those woodwork people to keep their mouth shut when they are only releasing statements.
| By diamond_lil on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 11:02 am:|
To me, Canseco is a product and consequence of the prevailing corruption, greed and double standard brought forth by the caretakers of MLB.
MLB, owners and players, stop at nothing to make more money and none of them have any credibility when it comes to morality, loyalty and honor about anything or anybody.
The owners juiced the balls and fiddled with the mound when they saw how much fans loved the long ball. So they turned the game into a circus act to entertain the masses and pack the stadiums.
Then players soon discovered how much more money they would be paid if they muscled the ball out of the park and the result is what we see...from Mark McGwire and Jose to Barry Bonds.
From Canseco to Tony LaRussa/Mark McGwire to Alderson/Bud Selig...I feel nothing but disgust and anger for the way they took advantage and distorted this wonderful game of baseball that was never meant to be played that way.
They are all guilty and they all have my disdain.
| By deajay on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 11:43 am:|
I don't know, maybe I'm naive. But if I were unjustly accused ... especially on one of the most watched nationwide broadcasts ... I would agree to go on the air and honestly deny it. I would do so with the proviso that I ONLY discuss me and my accuser and definitely not be asked to bring other peers into the discussion. To me, that's pretty simple ... if one is innocent of the accusations. And, hey, these interviews are taped, so one could also require, that once the taping is done ... and before it airs ... that one's attorney be allowed to review said interview prior to allowing its release.
In other words, any of those guys who are innocent, as they claim, IMO have little excuse for not going on the show and denying it.
"Canseco can help the game" by Skip Bayless
| By jenmed on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 12:04 pm:|
The guest sportswriter on 60 Minutes was actually Howard Bryant, the Boston Herald columinst who wrote the highly acclaimed Shutout: A Story of Race and Baseball in Boston.
He actually covered the A's for the Mercury News sometime in the 90's and also wrote for the Tribune. So he has a wide range of knowledge. Interesting guy.
| By muddlehead on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 12:41 pm:|
1. no brainer the names jose brought up juiced.
if they didn't, each and every one who's innocent would be all over the various media in denial. and then it's a he said / he said and jose would lose because we all want to assume jose is lying to make $$ or whatever.
2. bigger picture for me is does this asterisk mgwire's hr record? in my opinion, yes. will mlb see it this way? doubt it.
3. bonds breathing easier his name somehow not brought up
4. i thought pudge's name was pronounced ee-von eye-von like ivan the terrible.
| By yc2578 on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 12:53 pm:|
2. McGwire doesn't hold the record anymore.
3. Bonds has already admitted to using steroids "uknowingly" in the BALCO grand jury testimony. He probably wasn't mentioned because Canseco was never a teammate of his.
| By deajay on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 01:23 pm:|
Well, I understand Bonds' name is brought up in the book. A comment from Canseco on the order of, "all you have to do is look at him to know." Bonds gets off easy ... in the book ... because he was never a teammate of Canseco's.
| By dorrit on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 09:24 pm:|
Strange that LaRussa is speaking for McGwire, and McGwire is no where to be found. LaRussa has half page columns in the past two days regarding this. Tony apparently is covering his tracks, but McMcGwire is saying very little.
Are any of these players saying "Jose is a liar!"?
| By dorrit on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 09:25 pm:|
Do you think Jose will be sued?
| By eyleenn on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 10:12 pm:|
This excerpt from the ESPN story linked above addresses that question. The legal analyst for CBS radio said pretty much the same thing this morning:
Whether any of these players will seek libel suits against Canseco remains to be seen. Though some may view their failure to sue Canseco as an admission of guilt, the libel test is hard one. In order to win a libel case, a public figure like a professional athlete would have to prove that a certain statement or story was untrue, that the lie hurt his reputation and that Canseco knew it was wrong when he wrote it.
According to Tom Rhodes, an Atlanta-based attorney who specializes in libel cases, two-thirds of all media libel cases are dismissed before they are tried in court. If a trial takes place, Rhodes said, juries rule in favor of the plaintiff two-thirds of the time, though most of those verdicts are reversed on appeal.
"Before any one of these athletes sues for libel, they should realize that they are going to be part of a continuing story that will last for a long time," Rhodes said. "If they don't sue, the story is more likely to disappear."
| By deajay on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 10:51 pm:|
Bob Padecky (PD sports columnist) has a good column on this today. I cannot get the link to work. But you can access by going to link below, hitting on sports columnists, then scrolling down to Padecky. Actually, if you're reading this tonite, you can scroll down the front page and get immediate access (right side).
"Canseco targets need to fight back"
| By rayfossefan on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 03:11 am:|
I agree with whoever said Wallace didn't ask tough enough questions, but hey at least it wasn't Barbara Walters or someone sugar coating everything for us.
anyway, I think many of Canseco's claims may be true about other players, and like someone on here said, it's all about the money (like everything else in the world, sadly) ... and just look at how big players have got in the past few years, and the numbers being put up... it's ridiculous. And what was said about Sosa:
>>>On Sosa: "It looked like [Sosa] was trying to make up for lost time by bulking up faster than McGwire ever had. He gained thirty pounds, just like that, and got up to 260 (pounds) so fast, you could see the bloating in his face and neck. It seemed so obvious, it was a joke." <<<
man that is so true!!! anyway, the message he gives to kids is just plain wrong, it's almost a sneering slant at the whole industry and institution of sports to say something like that. Maybe Jose is a lost guy, but he has dropped a bombshell and someone had to do it. If Caminiti was still alive, it's likely he would have done something quite similar, although perhaps with a bit more taste.
hopefully this whole thing will get selig out of baseball for life. what's worse? betting on a few games or cheating your teammates, rivals, fans by using steroids????
| By kevink on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 08:42 am:|
Just read the first couple of chapters in the book.
At the beginning he spends several pages discussing why steroids are so great and this is a new era and you will never stop steroids.
He has no regrets and says they are good for you, even talks about HGH and says "you can take HGH all year round."
He doesn't talk about any side effects or how he was injured so much during his career and the funniest part is he says "I can do everything I did when I was 25 and even though I'm 40 I look much younger."
He left out "except play baseball."
Another thing is he says he started roiding at 20 and says he was 5'll. So he grew 5 inches from taking steroids? I didn't know they made you TALLER too!
I can't wait to read the rest.
| By simplefan on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 09:50 am:|
First day of Sales - Best Seller List!
| By sactodavey on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 10:56 am:|
the sad part of this whole thing is when people in baseballl think of the late 80's Oakland A's they will not think of the great teams that played then but the guys on steriods and how the drugs were used on the A's.
| By pachyderm on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 11:09 am:|
Here is more on the first of day of sales and Jose using the race card. Also, I hate when guys like Canseco or Bonds use race as a reason for not getting what they want, it's disgraceful to everybody of every race.
| By finleyshero on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 05:46 pm:|
He's right. Giambi has been retaining everything ever since he started taking it from The Boss.
| By dorrit on Wednesday, February 16, 2005 - 09:37 pm:|
I thought Wallace was quite good-you attack right away, and you won't get an interview. On 60 Minutes tonight, they FINALLY brought up suspicion of Bonds, ansd interviewed Sandy Alderson, who looked and acted like a complete liar. Canseco has these guys in the corner. Not many people are believing these owners stories, and not going for "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.."(meaning Jose!)
| By deajay on Wednesday, February 16, 2005 - 09:54 pm:|
I agree, dorrit; Alderson came across as a complete liar and with all the (expected) canned responses. No surprise, there. As far as I'm concerned this is bigger than the White Sox scandal. I think Canseco is a total idiot and I all but barfed when reading his forward/prologue and his opinion on roids, but I'm having a hard time not believing just about everything he is saying about McGwire and the rest.
What thoroughly disgusts me (and kudos to Wallace for asking the question) is Alderson's/mlb hierarchy position on the records being broken and no proof, blah, blah, blah. Well, how many years did they have an asterisk beside Maris' name when his only crime was playing a 162 game season? McGwire, Bonds, et al having set any HR records since '98 should at the very least have an asterisk. If I were a writer, not only wouldn't I vote for him for HOF, I wouldn't vote for Bonds either, even though Bonds did enough before he decided to become a HR hitter of giant proportions. They're both cheaters and if Pete Rose can't get in the HOF for gambling, they are even less deserving.
And I am so damn sick and tired of their copout steroid testing program. Wallace didn't do his homework (it is most apparent through this entire interview) or he would have zeroed in on the pisspoor testing program vs the Olympics' program, and been able to point out that blood tests are absolutely required for designer steroids.
| By eyleenn on Wednesday, February 16, 2005 - 10:52 pm:|
Alderson, the Marine/lawyer, is a total sellout.
| By kevink on Wednesday, February 16, 2005 - 11:45 pm:|
Why isn't Canseco doing any more interviews?
well said Deajay
| By diamond_lil on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 10:07 am:|
I have always said that Alderson sold his credibility to Bud Selig and Co when he took that job. It is a damn shame because he could make a difference, but just like Selig, he works for the owners and is willing to put their greed and corruption above the needs good of the game of baseball.
I can't help but wonder how things would have been different if baseball had an honest
commishioner who would put the integrity of the game above the interests of owners and players.
| By deajay on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 10:49 am:|
Well, I may be naive, but had Giammatti lived and/or Vincent remained commissioner, I think things would have been different. But again, I may be naive.
| By pachyderm on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 10:55 am:|
During last night's interview, Mike Wallace asked Canseco, "You and McGwire were buddies?" ,and Jose reply with "Yeah". "Buddies", I always thought McGwire and Canseco never had a close relationship, but overall this question was just a lead-in to real issue of the story. Also, here is something to think about MLB's new drug policy:
First offenders caught in three professional sports league:
MLB - 10 games without pay
NBA - 5 games without pay (see Robinson, Clifford)
NFL - 4 games without pay
I think both the MLB and NBA should follow World Anti-Doping policy since both sports are in the Olympics.
| By yc2578 on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 11:24 am:|
pachy, they weren't friends at all. They were only "buddies" in the Bash Brothers marketing gimmick. Oh well Canseco has come up with a lot of things in his head like he played in a non-exsistent World Series game (Game 6 of 2001, never happened) and a non-exsistent Spring Training game (the claim about Bret Boone that never happened).
| By diamond_lil on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 12:32 pm:|
TLR is also saying that he knew not only Canseco was using but two or three other players were using it...
He knew and he now says there is nothing he could do about it, but Sandy Alderson is saying he only heard rumors. That is total BS!!!!!
He and Sandy COULD DO something about it...
It is sheer BS trying to say the Players Union was at fault for not implementing the tougher drug policy.
What Alderson could have done was simply NOT HIRE or renew the contract of players who were on steroids. Or trade their ASS out of Oakland, like they did when Jose was not producing anymore in 92. But they sure didn't think of trading him when he was 40/40 and MVP in 88 and EVERYONE knew he was on steroids.
More recently the Yankees even agreed to take out of Giambi's contract the part about the use of steroids. So as long as Giambi was hitting his homeruns, they didn't mind at all.