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Canseco on Tejada

OAFC BBS - All Topics: Archive: Canseco on Tejada
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By rayfossefan on Wednesday, February 16, 2005 - 06:00 pm:

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylc=X3oDMTBpcDBuM2RlBF9TAzk1ODYxNzc3BHNlYwN0aA--?slug=ap-canseco-tejada&prov=ap&type=lgns

BALTIMORE (AP) -- Orioles shortstop Miguel Tejada denied that he used steroids and called the suggestions in Jose Canseco's new book ``false.''

``Any inference made by Jose Canseco that I used steroids is complete false,'' Tejada said in a statement Tuesday. ``I barely knew Jose during his career, so it is ridiculous for him to suggest we ever had discussions regarding their use. I work very hard to keep in shape and any suggestion that I use steroids, or any banned substance, is insulting and not worth discussing further.''

Tejada made his major league debut with Oakland on Aug. 27, 1997, the same day Canseco went on the disabled list for the rest of the season. Canseco did not return to the Athletics in 1998.

In his book, ``Juiced: Wild Times, Rampant 'Roids, Smash Hits, and How Baseball Got Big,'' Canseco names baseball players he says used steroids and defends the drugs' alleged dramatic benefits, offering Tejada as a case study.

Canseco wrote that the big contract Tejada signed with the Orioles before the 2004 season was the product of a ``new, pumped-up body'' that seemed to come from steroids -- though Canseco says he had no firsthand knowledge.

``Tejada set himself up -- himself and his family back home in the Dominican Republic,'' Canseco wrote. ``All he had to do was make himself bigger and stronger, and for Tejada that paid off.''

Canseco also wrote he ``can't say for sure'' whether Tejada bulked up with steroids but ``you have to trust your eyes.''

Excerpts from the book also name Barry Bonds, Mark McGwire and at least four Orioles, among other players, as possible steroid users. Rafael Palmeiro has called Canseco's claims ``ludicrous.''

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By rayfossefan on Wednesday, February 16, 2005 - 06:03 pm:

Now this is going a bit too far - I don't know 100% for sure that Tejada didn't use steroids, but I think we all watched him grow here, into a better player and a bigger player. But there was no exaggerated growth spurt with Miggy. The reason he got a good contract with the Orioles is because he is one hell of a player.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By kevink on Wednesday, February 16, 2005 - 06:14 pm:

Not true RFF.
He put on 30 pounds in one off season.
Canseco didn't accuse him of using steroids. I've read the book now. He said there were many reasons Tejada could have used steroids. I don't know one way or the other if Tejada used steroids, but it wouldn't shock me if he did.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By rayfossefan on Wednesday, February 16, 2005 - 06:23 pm:

interesting points kevin (that's my name as well btw!) - which season did he come back really bigger? +30lbs?

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By chris_d on Wednesday, February 16, 2005 - 08:40 pm:

I'm going to sound naive, but I don't think Tejada did steroids. Some of Canseco's accusations are probably correct -- the same way that if you threw a handful of crap against the wall, some of it might stick. Canseco's Tejada accusation, in my opinion, shows how low Canseco has sunk. His rationale for suspecting Tejada, in media interviews anyway (I haven't read the book), is that Tejada "seemed interested in steroids when I talked to him about it." Huh? To smear a possibly innocent player and make a serious accusation on such flimsy "evidence", man, how reckless is that?

MLB needs serious cleaning up, no one is questioning that. But Canseco's way is essentially a witch hunt. And, as has been stated before here recently, MLB's leadership (Selig, Fehr & other owners looking the other way as long as the $$ was rolling in) is culpable, too. The end result is that reporters now throw Tejada's name in the same sentence with known juicers like Giambi, Bonds and Sheffield as part of Canseco's "list." Given how weak Canseco's basis and reasoning are, that's totally unfair to Tejada.

As an eager rookie in '97, Tejada likely would have "seemed interested" in discussions on the tax code and Oakland school board races, too, if a veteran took five seconds to talk to him about it when he was a nobody. (Okay, he was a highly touted prospect, but at the major league level, he was a nobody.)

Also, I don't recall Tejada ever putting on 30 pounds in one season. And his HR output never has gone above 34 in one season. Further, his batting averages have never been cartoonish like other 'roid suspects. Let's take a look at his numbers starting in his rookie year:

Year- Avg- HR- RBI- OBP
1998 .233 11 45 .298
1999 .251 21 84 .325
2000 .275 30 115 .349
2001 .267 31 113 .326
2002 .308 34 131 .354
2003 .278 27 106 .336
2004 .311 34 150 .360

By and large, those are consistent numbers, with a natural, slow progression to a player's peak years. Most players have their peak production years between the ages of 27-31. If his birth certificate is accurate, Tejada was 28 last year in his best statistical year. A very normal occurrence for a pro athlete.

Perhaps most telling, he's yet to have any nagging injuries from carrying any "excess weight" despite playing every single game each year in the game's most athletic position.

I don't know. I don't buy it. Especially from Canseco, who was once one of my favorites. (I still have the Bash Brothers poster, by the way.)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By chrishorvath on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 01:40 am:

I always though Tejada was roiding. The growth, the acne, the puffiness, the temper tantrums... it all adds up.

The numbers scale is meaningless if he'd been roiding all along.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By kevink on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 08:36 am:

I don't know what year that was that he added 30 pounds RFF. 2001 or 2002.
I remember it well though.
Tejada came to spring training clearly looking much heavier, all puffed up.
I remember there was a discussion on this board about it. Most of us didn't believe it could be steroids at that time.

Canseco didn't "accuse" Tejada, but you're right ChrisD, he definitely dragged his name through the mud.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By diamond_lil on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 10:22 am:

Canseco reminds me of a person who is drowing...
he is grabbing anybody he can to drag down with him. He is one angry and desperate person who feels he was forsaken by the world when in reality he was the one who gave up on himself.

He credits "steroids" for his own success, so he believes anybody who puts up good numbers is due to the juice.

The saddest thing about all of this is that I, and many other fans will be thinking like him...
because of the reckless and irresponsible way MLB has dealt with this problem for the last 20 years, I don't trust any of them anymore.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By pachyderm on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 10:35 am:

This question maybe obvious, but do you guys think is jealous of Tejada since Miguel is a likable Latino ballplayer more then Jose ever was here in Oakland or anywhere. Thus,making Tejada's popularity destroys Canseco's double standard theory in a sense. All the names, Jose is naming all have "he said/she said" factor but there may lay some truth.

(Hey ChrisD, still have the Bash Brothers poster you kick ass!!)

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By kevink on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 10:52 am:

There is a lot of truth to what Jose says, but his book is also full of whining and playing victim. He claims people didn't like him because he's Cuban, and nobody was ready to accept a Cuban superstar athlete in America then. I find this hard to believe. Sosa is from the Dominican and was one of the most loveable athletes until more recently.

I'm glad the information is being made public but Canseco is living on a different planet and wants to believe everyone is out to get him for any reason he can find except reasons that involve looking at himself and his own behavior.

I have a lot more to say about this and will do so when I have completed the book.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By deajay on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 01:34 pm:

I agree, Kevin. Also, where he touts himself as such a great athlete while admitting steroids, in effect, made him that way. While I believe a lot of what he says re steroid users, he is otherwise filled with a lot of BS on other issues. And it is pretty evident he loathes McGwire.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By okplayer on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 01:36 pm:

I understand wanting to defend miggy, he's my favorite ballplayer, but 100% of these sluggers could be on the juice for all we know. sorry.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By oakland_j on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 05:41 pm:

Tejada did come into spring training significantly bigger one year, but it was fat and not muscle. I remember there were some concerns about him being out of shape since he did not play winter ball.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By deajay on Thursday, February 17, 2005 - 09:40 pm:

Oakland_j is correct. I don't know whether Tejada took steroids or not; but as far as the 30lb weight gain, that sounds correct ... but over several years. That is not unusual at all, going from a skinny rookie, to putting on 30lbs. over a period of 7 years.

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By washfan on Friday, February 18, 2005 - 01:16 am:

KeninK is the new steroids McCarthy. As SactoD would say, "Put down the crack pipe"

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By diamond_lil on Friday, February 18, 2005 - 09:51 am:

Yeah, you can bet the owners are 'banking' (pun intended) the fans are more than willing to accept their lies:

*we weren't informed and had no proof
*we knew but couldn't do anything about it because of the player's union
*Jose's is the liar but McGwire is a saint
*the FBI agent that told MLB about the use of steroids never really called and is now lying
*we suspected but could do nothing
*we now have a great testing program that will clean up baseball

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of pageLink to this message   By kevink on Friday, February 18, 2005 - 10:26 am:

So washfan, I suppose you would rather bury your head in the sand and not know anything about the steroids debacle?


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